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Author Topic: How to guide: Calibra engine swaps  (Read 71988 times)

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Offline [email protected]

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Re: How to guide: Calibra engine swaps
« Reply #30 on: April 26, 2009, 01:45:22 AM »
Quote from: garyb on April 26, 2009, 01:24:18 AM
euro2 was 1996.
Goodbye LET/ XE. :'(
Hello Ecotec..  8)
I didn't realise that there weren't any LETs after 1996.

Quote
1993 ( more precisely 1992) was Euro1.
This heralded the introduction of the catalytic converter hence 20XE became C20XE. The LET wasn't sold without a cat though ( and I don't think the 20XE was fitted in the Calibra either )

I'm confused?  Early Calibras didn't have Catalytic converters.  So what engine was fitted in the pre-1992/pre-CAT/'Redtop' 16v Calibras, if it wasn't the 20XE?  I thought that the 'Redtop' WAS the non-CAT C20XE and that the X20XEV 'Ecotec' had the CAT & EGR.  Otherwise:
  • 20XE - 16v engine (150bhp?)
  • Pre-1993: C20XE - 16v engine with CAT to meet Euro 1 (150bhp?)
  • 1993 on: X20XEV - 16v engine with CAT & EGR to meet Euro 2 (134bhp)
If so this doesn't make sense, because it suggests that the CAT made no difference to the power.  In which case, what would be the point of de-catting?
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gorytus

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Re: How to guide: Calibra engine swaps
« Reply #31 on: April 26, 2009, 03:34:56 AM »
First off, let us drop the utterly misguided moniker 'redtop' from the discussion; save that for the kiddiwinks with their zorsts & cones. In any proper engine discussion the use of that description only serves to confuse.

Quote
I didn't realise that there weren't any LETs after 1996.
??? And what made you erroneously start thinking there were?

Tis quite easy really. First came the 20XE. NO cat, 156ps
For impending Euro1, this was tweaked by having a CAT  + Motronic 2.5, a closed loop ( lambda running) ecu, fitted. This engine is the C20XE, 150ps. The Turbo version, C20LET,204ps, followed in 1992.

GM , like most others, changed over to Cat engines well before the deadline for Euro1. AFAIK, the Calibra was never fitted with the 20XE; however legally you can remove the Cat on pre-Aug 1992 cars.

Euro2 had to be implemented by the end of 1996. GM replaced the brilliant C20XE with the pathetic X20XEV,136ps to meet that emission standard. Naturally the C20LET was dropped, it's eventual replacement being the Z20LET( with variations) which was never fitted in the Calibra.

For those still unable to grasp the extremely basic camcover 'L' plate identity scenario, there is a similar thread running concurrently here  ::)
http://www.clubcalibra.com/index.php?topic=26072.0









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teabag1

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Re: How to guide: Calibra engine swaps
« Reply #32 on: April 26, 2009, 10:21:33 AM »
well to end the fuss, mine is a sh*tty ecotec :( lol it has the straight black cover (no L shape)
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Offline [email protected]

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Re: How to guide: Calibra engine swaps
« Reply #33 on: April 26, 2009, 17:14:26 PM »
Quote from: garyb on April 26, 2009, 03:34:56 AM
First off, let us drop the utterly misguided moniker 'redtop' from the discussion; save that for the kiddiwinks with their zorsts & cones. In any proper engine discussion the use of that description only serves to confuse.
 ??? And what made you erroneously start thinking there were?

You'll note that, when I use the name, I usually include the engine designation as well, to avoid any confusion.  However, 'Redtop' is frequently used (by others) without the engine designation, so I use both to link the designation to the description (of the engine that usually, if not always, had the red insert).

Quote
Tis quite easy really. First came the 20XE. NO cat, 156ps

...but this is the engine that you said:

Quote from: garyb on April 26, 2009, 01:24:18 AM
I don't think the 20XE was fitted in the Calibra either

I believe that the first Calibras were being manufactured in 1988(?), and introduced to the UK in 1989(?).  So, if they didn't have the 156bhp 20XE engine, what engine were they fitted with, if they didn't have to comply with Euro1 until 1992/3?  Or did they only have the C20NE 8v engine before the C20XE was introduced?

Quote
For impending Euro1, this was tweaked by having a CAT  + Motronic 2.5, a closed loop ( lambda running) ecu, fitted. This engine is the C20XE, 150ps. The Turbo version, C20LET,204ps, followed in 1992.

GM , like most others, changed over to Cat engines well before the deadline for Euro1. AFAIK, the Calibra was never fitted with the 20XE; however legally you can remove the Cat on pre-Aug 1992 cars.

...so the C20XE was fitted in anticipation of the Euro1 regulations?

Quote
Euro2 had to be implemented by the end of 1996. GM replaced the brilliant C20XE with the pathetic X20XEV,136ps to meet that emission standard. Naturally the C20LET was dropped, it's eventual replacement being the Z20LET( with variations) which was never fitted in the Calibra.

I didn't think that I was confused about the straight or L-shaped insert - until I read:

Quote from: teabag1 on April 26, 2009, 10:21:33 AM
well to end the fuss, mine is a sh*tty ecotec :( lol it has the straight black cover (no L shape)










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Offline carl

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Re: How to guide: Calibra engine swaps
« Reply #34 on: April 26, 2009, 17:23:47 PM »
my old h reg calibra was a 20xe.
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Offline [email protected]

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Re: How to guide: Calibra engine swaps
« Reply #35 on: April 26, 2009, 17:27:41 PM »
Quote from: mr c on April 26, 2009, 17:23:47 PM
my old h reg calibra was a 20xe.

Aha.  So it was fitted to the very early Calibras...
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Offline carl

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Re: How to guide: Calibra engine swaps
« Reply #36 on: April 26, 2009, 17:43:33 PM »
Quote from: [email protected] on April 26, 2009, 17:27:41 PM
Aha.  So it was fitted to the very early Calibras...
yep...it was a pain to get bits for....i wanted a afm but i couldn't find one anywhere, it was the type with the adjuster screw on it....but i think the changed that when the started using the cat ive no idea why though?
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bodybuilding thread! the thread for winners!
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http://www.clubcalibra.com/index.php?topic=34701.msg450951#msg450951
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Offline Bad Kid

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Re: How to guide: Calibra engine swaps
« Reply #37 on: April 26, 2009, 22:56:51 PM »
Quote from: mr c on April 26, 2009, 17:23:47 PM
my old h reg calibra was a 20xe.

You sure mate?

No lambda?
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Offline carl

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Re: How to guide: Calibra engine swaps
« Reply #38 on: April 26, 2009, 23:00:14 PM »
Quote from: Chavtastic on April 26, 2009, 22:56:51 PM
You sure mate?

No lambda?
about 80% sure...the only cars i could of got the afm from was the cavs and old astras
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bodybuilding thread! the thread for winners!
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**Carl's calibra project**
http://www.clubcalibra.com/index.php?topic=34701.msg450951#msg450951
You argued with an idiot, I brought you down to my level and I beat you with experience.

Offline Bad Kid

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Re: How to guide: Calibra engine swaps
« Reply #39 on: April 26, 2009, 23:00:56 PM »
Ah fair enough. I see no reason why they wouldn't use the 20XE if it was in Astras on the same year.

Come to think of it, I had a H-plate XE Calibra... maybe that had one.
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gorytus

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Re: How to guide: Calibra engine swaps
« Reply #40 on: April 26, 2009, 23:50:23 PM »
Quote
about 80% sure...the only cars i could of got the afm from was the cavs and old astras
Has nowt to do with AFM.

Did you have a lambda sensor & cat fitted?

I haven't got a copy of the EPC on this laptop so I can't verify but I've never come across a 20XE in a Calibra. MrC, what is the code on yur ecu?

Quote
However, 'Redtop' is frequently used (by others) without the engine designation, so I use both to link the designation to the description (of the engine that usually, if not always, had the red insert).
From time to time I attempt to correct it's meaningless usage but with each new wave of user there is more water to push uphill. It get's worse; now some clowns are starting to use it to describe the LET too, sob sob  :( 8)
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Offline Bad Kid

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Re: How to guide: Calibra engine swaps
« Reply #41 on: April 27, 2009, 00:15:59 AM »
Quote from: garyb on April 26, 2009, 23:50:23 PM
From time to time I attempt to correct it's meaningless usage but with each new wave of user there is more water to push uphill. It get's worse; now some clowns are starting to use it to describe the LET too, sob sob  :( 8)

I'm with you on that man.

Maybe the mods should swear-filter the word?
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Offline carl

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Re: How to guide: Calibra engine swaps
« Reply #42 on: April 27, 2009, 08:53:25 AM »
Quote from: garyb on April 26, 2009, 23:50:23 PM
Has nowt to do with AFM.

Did you have a lambda sensor & cat fitted?

I haven't got a copy of the EPC on this laptop so I can't verify but I've never come across a 20XE in a Calibra. MrC, what is the code on yur ecu?
From time to time I attempt to correct it's meaningless usage but with each new wave of user there is more water to push uphill. It get's worse; now some clowns are starting to use it to describe the LET too, sob sob  :( 8)
i cant remember it was a few years ago and i didnt know any thing about engines back then...but i know i had to change the loom and ecu and and all other bits and bobs and that was like for like swap.
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bodybuilding thread! the thread for winners!
http://www.clubcalibra.com/index.php?topic=34651.msg449718#msg449718
**Carl's calibra project**
http://www.clubcalibra.com/index.php?topic=34701.msg450951#msg450951
You argued with an idiot, I brought you down to my level and I beat you with experience.

gorytus

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Re: How to guide: Calibra engine swaps
« Reply #43 on: April 28, 2009, 00:05:44 AM »
Quote from: Chavtastic on April 27, 2009, 00:15:59 AM
I'm with you on that man.

Maybe the mods should swear-filter the word?
I suppose it does have uses on the Troubleshooting & Tuning threads; enabling one to easily seperate the wheat from the chaff.

No need to look back through a users posts to establish credibility, tosh like 'Get a Redtop and stick a cone on it' etc is damning enough, lol.
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Offline domenico88

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Re: How to guide: Calibra engine swaps
« Reply #44 on: July 24, 2009, 03:44:46 AM »
Hi there,

Just done an engine swap on my Calibra. Both engines came from 92 models and are early-ish C20XEs, with Motronic 2.5 ECUs. The swap itself was done with minimal fuss but unfortunately I only found this forum after the swap was done and did not use the donor ECU. When we went to start the car, it started without a problem but then after it revs to a certain point it starts to misfire and sounds like its running on 2 or 3 cylinders. Double checked that all the wiring was fine, that there was spark and did a fuel pressure test which was all fine. Air flow was also fine. Wanted to try and swap the ECUs over but the mechanic has already had the donor car taken away without removing its ECU and the scrap yard says its crushed and in China by now. Did the paperclip test and keep coming up with code 16 Knock signal circuit no change in voltage. Changed the knock sensor as I know that a faulty one can retard the timing. No effect. Not getting a crank sensor error but my tacho seems to be going haywire so was thinking maybe it could be faulty or not sitting at 90 degrees, but the auto electrician says he doesnt think so and hasnt bothered to check it. He is convinced the ECU doesnt match up with the engine. I know that between 91 and 93 the C20XE Calibras were fitted with 3 or 4 different Motronic 2.5 units. If the units from the donor car and the current car do in fact have different part numbers, can the ECU i have be re-programmed or something similar to be usable with the donor engine? Any help would be appreciated. Am I doomed to buying a new ECU?????

Cheers
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