ClubCalibra | Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
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Offline Bad Kid

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Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« on: December 22, 2009, 23:10:34 PM »
Right for those that have asked, the basic jist of switching to a Garrett is:

Manifold
Option 1- The first option is to buy a 200sx stainless tubular manifold. There are plenty of them on eBay for under £100. They are for Nissan SR20DET engines (Pulsar/200sx)
Then buy a C20LET flange (Chris Astley Motorsport / eBay), cut off the SR20DET flange and TIG weld this on. The ports are actually quite similar to the C20LET, so only minimal amounts of bending are required to get the ports to line up to the new flange. Similarly, it then hangs the turbo in a convenient place between the gearbox bellhousing and power steering pump. The lower flange can be for whatever turbo you want, typically a T25 or T3 footprint.

Option 2 - Buy the above, pre-made. These have been on eBay, and may be more expensive but will save hassle and possibly allow you to have an external wastegate.

Option 3 - C20LET aftermarket manifold - These have cropped up in recent years, of varying quality from various sources both in the UK and Europe. Several eBay sellers and UK tuners offer various designs, styles and fitments for £300-£1000. Expect to pay around £500 for a good aftermarket manifold

The modified SR20DET manifold vs a LET aftermarket manifold is an interesting comparison, as I've seen engines running both setups making good power.

Boost pipes
You'll need a mix of alloy pipework and/or silicone pipework to connect the AFM to your new turbo, and the turbo outlet to the intercooler. This is often quite straightforward but be prepared for a lot of trial and error to get it right. Get any alloy pipes you use swaged for good measure. All of this can be seen in my touring car build thread.


AFM to turbo pipe (top), turbo to FMIC pipe (bottom)


Swaged pipes

Water pipes

It is possible to run certain models of Garrett without a water jacket, or you can adapt your standard water lines to Garrett fitment. Find your local Pirtek (hydraulic hose) dealer for this, they make hoses up to suit on the spot and are very affordable.


Oil feed/return
Again, Pirtek are your friends for a braided or rubber oil feed/return. Be sure to use a restrictor if your turbo needs one.

Tightening an oil feed


Exhaust
A new turbo means a new exhaust downpipe elbow. Use a gasket as a template to get a flange made up, then take this to an exhaust fabricator who can make you an elbow to mate to your system. Why not have a full system made while you're at it?

Custom downpipe for a Calibra with a Garrett turbo

Pictures and a write-up of my Garrett conversion can be found here
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Offline Trigger

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #1 on: December 22, 2009, 23:18:44 PM »
Topic moved to relevent section. Yet another top guide Ben 8)
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Offline Chip

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #2 on: December 22, 2009, 23:41:04 PM »
Ben, if you go onto VS there are some good pics of the peterg manifolds I had, and of sbd16v's garret setup on an engine stand that can be seen really clearly.

Would be worth adding in as examples
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Offline Bad Kid

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #3 on: December 22, 2009, 23:53:10 PM »
Quote from: Chip on December 22, 2009, 23:41:04 PM
Ben, if you go onto VS there are some good pics of the peterg manifolds I had, and of sbd16v's garret setup on an engine stand that can be seen really clearly.

Would be worth adding in as examples

I'm not registered mate, if you post the image here though that would be cool :)
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Offline Chip

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #4 on: December 23, 2009, 10:00:46 AM »
PeterG manifolds:











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Offline Chip

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #5 on: December 23, 2009, 10:03:47 AM »
Nortech manifold on Rob's Astra engine




build thread is here if anyone wants a read:
http://www.vauxhall-sport-forum.com/phpBB2/astra-gte-turbo-t1054,start,60.html


That setup is good enough for 170mph inside a mile, and 150mph in half a mile :D
Approx 400bhp

VERY good spread of torque though, its pulling hard from 3K-7K
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Offline Martin.

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #6 on: December 23, 2009, 10:27:49 AM »
Thank you Black Arts Carbon & Chip, I've bookmarked page! will be somthing I'll be looking into in the new year when I have a bit more money!
So may bring up this thread again if in need of a bit of help from you guy's or anyone else!
Thanks.
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Offline richiem

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #7 on: December 23, 2009, 12:31:16 PM »
Nice one chaps ;)
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Offline Chip

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #8 on: December 23, 2009, 13:22:58 PM »
Its such a shame those peterg manifolds are no longer available, they were pieces of art rather than just amazing engineering.

Ive got the last one he ever made before his tragic death still sat in the garage at home, got no immediate use for it but dont want to let it go because I know it can never be replaced!
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Offline Bodgetastic

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #9 on: December 24, 2009, 01:04:33 AM »
Quote from: Chip on December 23, 2009, 13:22:58 PM
Its such a shame those peterg manifolds are no longer available, they were pieces of art rather than just amazing engineering.

Except for being a pain to fit they are gorgeous manifolds, I really didn't enjoy wrapping mine in volcanic ash  ;D.   

Might be worth highlighting the difference between external/internal wastegates which will influence turbo choice / manifold design.     

I would personally try and avoid pertek where possible, I know many people use them and they have been extremely helpful to me when desperate and are cheap but they are ultimately industrial suppliers and in my experience use bulky fittings with pain the ass threads.

Also worth adding an inline filter for the oil supply, something like this....






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Offline Bad Kid

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #10 on: December 24, 2009, 02:59:23 AM »
Pirtek can be as cheap or as expensive as you want ;) At the end of the day, as long as the oil lines don't leak, and have the right fittings on them, it doesn't really matter who makes them TBH. I went for Pirtek because I know they will be properly crimped up and have a burst pressure way beyond what the engine could produce.
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Offline Chip

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #11 on: December 24, 2009, 10:25:11 AM »
I agree on the pirtek fittings, some of it is a bit bulky, for me thats not a problem as my engine has a lot of space around it, but for some applications its awkward, so just a case of knowing when you can or cant use them.

Earl's filter is pretty much essential for a GT turbo, but of no real value on a T series generally.

I use one as im on a GT35R
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Offline tommygards

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #12 on: December 24, 2009, 19:25:14 PM »
thanks ever so much for the thread, its really good.  A couple of useful additions would be the difference between internal / external wastegate like Chip suggested, also what size thread / diameter hose is needed would be really useful.  Thanks again :D
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Offline Ash,

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #13 on: December 25, 2009, 02:20:14 AM »
I'm stupid,

Whats the difference between internal and external waste gates?
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Offline skorps1971

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #14 on: December 25, 2009, 04:42:55 AM »
hi this mite be totaly silly but .....  you know the air thing that makes the air twist like a wirl wind.  and you putit in the air flow to make the air movefaster. could you make something to fit in the manofold.to make the air in there move faster to go in the turbo( would it make more power or an just an idiot and  now nothing about how turbos work ....
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Offline Chip

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #15 on: December 25, 2009, 10:43:05 AM »
Quote from: skorps1971 on December 25, 2009, 04:42:55 AM
hi this mite be totaly silly but .....  you know the air thing that makes the air twist like a wirl wind.  and you putit in the air flow to make the air movefaster. could you make something to fit in the manofold.to make the air in there move faster to go in the turbo( would it make more power or an just an idiot and  now nothing about how turbos work ....

You DO realise those things dont work and are a load of old bollocks dont you?
Only you sound like you really want to fit some nasty chav piece of shite onto a serious engine there?
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Offline Gav

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #16 on: December 25, 2009, 11:00:06 AM »
Quote from: Ash, on December 25, 2009, 02:20:14 AM
I'm stupid,

Whats the difference between internal and external waste gates?

An internal wastegate is built in as part of the turbocharger's turbine housing. It consists of an flapper door that allows exhaust gas to bypass the the turbine blade, thus regulating the amount of boost created. An external wastegate is a separate unit from the turbocharger, located on the exhaust header/manifold between the engine and the turbo. Regulating boost is done in a similar bypassing method, but is done before the exhaust gas reaches the turbochargers turbine housing. The size of an internal wastegate is proportionate to the size of the turbo, where as an external wastegate, because it's located outside of the turbo, can be made much larger. An internal wastegate becomes too small when the volume of exhaust gasses coming from the motor exceeds the efficiency of that size wastegate. That's when an external wastegate can be utilized, to vent the extra exhaust gasses to stabilize boost pressure.

(from a tuning site, not my head lol :D)
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Offline tommygards

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #17 on: December 25, 2009, 11:18:55 AM »
thats a lot of help. is a screamer pipe the pipe that puts the extra exhaust gases to atmosphere?  i heard they arent legal and so you have to get the pipe welded back into the exhaust after the turbo? i might be completely wrong, i just dont know.
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Offline skorps1971

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #18 on: December 25, 2009, 11:30:18 AM »
Quote from: Chip on December 25, 2009, 10:43:05 AM
You DO realise those things dont work and are a load of old bollocks dont you?
Only you sound like you really want to fit some nasty chav piece of sh*te onto a serious engine there?

lol as i said it sounds silly.. and no it only came in my head as i saw ab add for one for the air flow and i was boerd so mind wandered .. daft me .. i`ll stop thinking and go play in the sand
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Offline Bodgetastic

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Re: Upgrading a C20LET turbo (fao RichieM, Tommyguards + Martin P)
« Reply #19 on: December 25, 2009, 11:41:18 AM »
Quote from: tommygards on December 25, 2009, 11:18:55 AM
thats a lot of help. is a screamer pipe the pipe that puts the extra exhaust gases to atmosphere?  i heard they arent legal and so you have to get the pipe welded back into the exhaust after the turbo? i might be completely wrong, i just dont know.

Yea its called a screamer pipe from the noise it makes venting the exhaust gases from the external wastegate.  If its welded back into the exhaust you wouldnt hear it.  Mines gone through a couple of MOTs probably because the garage havent spotted it / dont know what it is and an mot test 'shouldnt' get the car on boost anyway so wouldnt hear it.  

Its worth noting if you are thinking of one is that you are likely to get thrown off any track due to the noise it makes so if you are thinking of building a track car always plumb it back into the exhaust.  



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